Coastal Climate Justice with the Foundation for Louisiana's Liz Williams Russell

Peter Ravella  0:20  
Hello, everybody, and welcome to the American shoreline podcast. This is Peter rivella, co host of the show

Tyler Buckingham  0:27  
and this is Tyler Buckingham, the other co host,

Peter Ravella  0:29  
you know, Tyler for months, we've been talking about climate change. And we've been saying that climate change fundamentally is a people problem indeed, as opposed to a science issue. And one of the states in America where this is most vividly occurring is the is Louisiana,

Tyler Buckingham  0:45  
we all have something to learn from Louisiana.

Peter Ravella  0:47  
But there's a lot to learn down there. And we're going to be talking about the community basis of this issue and how it's being approached in Louisiana with a great guest. It's Liz Williams Russell, who is the climate justice program director for the foundation for Louisiana, and I'm really looking forward to learning about what she's been up to down in Louisiana, in dealing with climate related issues in, in in the Gulf of Mexico and on Louisiana coasts.

Tyler Buckingham  1:16  
Yeah, in particular, how she is spearheading an effort to go to the community level go to the people and the actual people now, not just those of us who are professionals, those of us who work in this space, you know, what I call the officer class, you know, like, like, you got to get out into the real world into real people's lives and

Peter Ravella  1:42  
empower. I think it's about empowerment isn't it?

Tyler Buckingham  1:45  
I think it's about empowerment, I think it's about just good government actually, and in our society needing to take care of ourselves as a body, but I'm really looking forward to this conversation with Liz I heard Liz speak at the ocean blue happy hour that gets put on every so often there by our friends in DC Emily and Rennie and I was moved, what can I say it was a really, Liz gave a really moving presentation. And I said at that moment like I've got to reach out to Liz and get her on the show. Good move. So here we are, and I'm really looking forward to it, Peter. But before we get into it, let's have a quick word from our sponsors.

Advertisement Read  2:29  
The American shoreline Podcast Network and coastal news. today.com are brought to you by Lj a engineering with 28 offices along the Gulf Coast. The folks at Lj engineering are at the top of the craft in the areas of coastal restoration, coastal infrastructure, rivers and channels numerical modeling, disaster recovery and design and construction oversight. Be sure to check out their brand new coastal resilience department headed up by asbs own Peter rivella. Find them@lga.com coastal transplants coastal transplants offers high quality native and wetland plants extensive agricultural and horticultural experience and the skilled and respectful crews to get your project built. Make coastal transplants your one stop solution for restoring the dune and wetland ecology of your home or barrier island. Learn more at coastal transplants.com. Dune science group. Did you know that fiberglass is one of the strongest and most durable building materials in the world that it is resistant to deterioration caused by UV light and saltwater? Well, the dune science group does. They offer a full slate of solutions for Dune walkovers and boardwalks that are made of fiberglass and built to last. They handle your Dune walkover project from beginning to end including permitting design and construction of the strongest and most durable Dune walkover on the market. Learn more at Dune science group.com and be sure to subscribe to the coastal news today daily blast newsletter at coastal news today.com for daily updates on the events and news that shaped the coastal discussion. Want to support the discussion and promote your company? We have sponsorship packages available now. Email me to learn more at Chloe at coastal News today.com. That's ch l o e at coastal News today.com. Hope to hear from you and enjoy the show.

Peter Ravella  4:11  
Well, Liz, welcome to the American shoreline podcast. And thank you very much for taking time to speak to our listeners about the important work you're doing in Louisiana. Welcome to the show.

Liz Russell  4:21  
Thank you so much for having me.

Peter Ravella  4:23  
Well, you know, would you be so kind as to introduce our audience to the work that you're doing? The foundation for Louisiana? What is your what's your objective and tell us about tell us about what you're doing in your work?

Liz Russell  4:39  
Yeah, sure. So I have the privilege of as you mentioned, operating as the climate justice program director. We have launched this portfolio about five years ago initially called the coastal resilience leveraged fund and it has transformed into the climate justice portfolio. foundation for Louisiana was started Actually, in the days immediately following Hurricane Katrina, meant to be a philanthropic intermediary that could get resources out on the ground, to communities, to communities that were being left out of the traditional philanthropic response as well as our institutional responses to disaster. So really responding to the complexities and the the sort of added and rippling consequences of acute and chronic disasters as part of the DNA of the foundation. And we fully recognize that without action, climate change, as well as our institutional responses to it will exacerbate the existing inequities that are already built into our communities at all levels. We're very explicit at the foundation that in understanding that black communities, indigenous communities, communities of color, and low income communities are more likely to live and work near toxic facilities like petrochemical companies that emit pollutants and shorten and impact the quality of life, those communities more likely to reside in areas where there's more flooding, more likely to receive inadequate infrastructure investment to actually mitigate risks and prevent disasters. And then those communities also experienced delayed and insufficient response and recovery investments during and after emergencies. And so with this lens, the portfolio really grew out of an understanding at the time of the extent of ongoing land loss across the state of Louisiana, which, as you know, was caused by both the management or mismanagement of the Mississippi River channelization of navigation canals for oil and gas and maritime purposes. subsidence, coastal erosion, saltwater intrusion on and on. And we're at a place in Louisiana, where we've already lost almost about 1900 square miles of land since the 1930s. So sea level rise is not a future scenario here. And the impacts of climate change across our communities are not a future scenario. And so we have been doing this work really, since the inception of the foundation and continue to double down on expand and support this work as we continue to also center the communities most impacted by these changes and ensure that they have the seats of design and decision making tables for for now, 10 years from now, you know, 25 years from now and impacts that we'll see 50 years from now.

Tyler Buckingham  7:34  
So Liz, obviously, this is a massive challenge here. And we know we've we here on ESPN, we talk a lot about Louisiana, we actually run Delta dispatches our audiences, of course knows Delta dispatches, we run that show so that we can learn from what's going on Louisiana, we kind of view Louisiana as the tip of the spear in our societies attempt to confront the issues of the coastal issues related to climate change. How do you begin this process? I mean, I'm interested out of from the aftermath of Katrina, which is a obviously a very finite disaster, it had it had a bit it happened to this a different type of disaster that's happening kind of slowly. How do you approach what's the approach here? How do you go about accomplishing these goals?

Liz Russell  8:37  
Yeah. So as listeners on this show will obviously know from all of your collaboration and work in Louisiana, the coastal master plan was our initial attempt to assess all of the ways that land loss is occurring, and begin to mitigate that both through restoration structural and non structural investments, mitigate the flood risk that comes along with that, and, and the coastal protection and restoration authority was really formed also after Hurricane Katrina and read that in 2005. And we've taken many steps as a state to both understand at an incredible level of sophistication, the extent of land loss, land, land growth potential, as well as increased flood risk with relative sea level rise over time that we can expect. And what when, when we launched this portfolio at the foundation for Louisiana, what we were hearing from community, from our community partners was the coastal master plan does a lot of great things. And also, there are some things that are impacts to our communities, which are not included in that. So for example, you know, if you had to evacuate for Hurricane Katrina, and you couldn't come back to your home for three to six months. You know, what does it mean when your employer has Found another employee, we're not considering Job Change and economic disparities or impacts in areas that are losing land, and it seeing increased flood risk, or what does it do to the community and culture when you're able to elevate these seven houses, and these 10 are eligible for buyouts over time. But the rest of the homes may not receive investments? What does it do to the fabric and the sort of cultural identity of a place? And, you know, what does it mean when you have schools shutting down? Because anecdotally, we're seeing, and also, there's lots of research to support this as well. We're seeing people with resources be able to pick up and move to areas they perceive as higher and safer grounds. Excuse me. So what are all of the impacts across everything we care about? And we were hearing from our partners, you know, we want to be a part of this design and decision making, we want to not be shown a plan when it's in draft form. And we want to be a part of actually creating the solutions for all the ways that coastal and climate change impacts our communities. And so way back in 2015, we were initiating a process to actually Okay, well, if we're gonna design a plan, a planning process, even that is inclusive and equitable, and brings the people most impacted to the table from day one. What does that look like? So obviously, there are some logistical questions like, how many meetings do we have? What barriers can we remove for folks? So can we provide childcare and food that people like and will show up for transportation? How do we accommodate language barriers, obviously, language barriers, in terms of non native English speakers, but also the very technical reality of flood risk information? How do we make sure that community leaders in those places have the tools that they need to connect their own personal experience, to the ways that decisions are made, and how they might organize and advocate for their communities. And so a sort of design scheme for what that planning process would look like, really grew from those conversations. The last thing I'll mention is that not unsurprisingly, people don't want to hear this information from people that are outside of their community. We heard a lot of, you know, somebody comes down from Baton Rouge and New Orleans, somebody comes from up the road or up the river up the bayou. And they come down here, and they tell me what I'm supposed to do with my community now, or 10 years from now and 25 years from now without any resources for me to actually make those decisions. So what does it mean for me or a leader in my community, obviously, I'm speaking as a leader in my community, to be able to know where those decisions are made, who's the correct person to go to for XYZ, community need, and be able to really advance the things that I care about, and the things that my family, friends, neighbors colleagues care about? And so so our work has really emerged from from those conversations.

Tyler Buckingham  13:16  
It's very cool. And I, it's obviously a massive undertaking, but so essential, can I would like to go back to this idea of the state of the foundation for the week, because what you're talking about, like one could argue, I suppose that this is like government duty. This is what the government's supposed to be doing all this, all this business going out to the communities understanding what they need, listening, you know, but, but, but you work for the foundation for Louisiana. And you mentioned earlier, with the creation of the foundation after Katrina, there were some holes in the response. And I'm curious, this dynamic, you know, post Katrina, in this climate justice perspective, how, as a foundation, you are able to fill the gaps, I suppose you might say, but can you talk a little bit about like, what what the dynamic of being a foundation versus the, you know, the state government versus other layers of government?

Liz Russell  14:24  
So are and so there's so many, there's so many sort of hurdles and opportunities and the question that you just asked, I think there is a reality that these conversations are really difficult, right. And so even with the coastal master plan, where we fully articulate and this has unanimously passed through our majority and super majority republican state legislature, three times now, you know, the coastal master plan illustrates that we don't expect some of our communities to still be there. 50 years So now 25 years from now, even with full investment in the coastal master plan, and we can do tremendous things to restore land and reduce risk over time. And still, some of our places are bound, even with that investment, to wash away into the sea and are our communities, we feel that right we feel, you can feel the energy of the land disappearing around you. And, and there's a reality that those conversations are tough and no agency per se, is designated to have those conversations. So from a very specific, you know, just like who, who says, Who goes out into the community and says this, and not just puts the map up on the wall, because we do have agencies and partners in the NGO space that puts the map up on the wall and show up from time where, where the limb loss disappears, but whose job is it to have the most difficult conversations about the realities of our our future conditions, our current conditions, that's not explicitly designated at a broader scale, you know, when it comes to thinking about the vast implications of coastal and climate change across all of the sectors of our lives. community and culture, economy and jobs, environment, from a housing standpoint, transit standpoint, water management standpoint, those are all different decision makers. And at the time, and we are really advancing work in Louisiana now differently, and to bring some of those agencies in, but the agencies whose jobs it is to think about economic development or public health, or housing and affordability, they're not brought in, per se, to the conversations about coastal and climate change. And you see this at all levels of government, where we have divested from government and continue to reduce our institutional capacity to deal with the work they already have. Those decision makers are not inclined to expand out into a much, I would say, a much more vast and existential set of circumstances to which they might not be extremely comfortable. So when the foundation for Louisiana, in 2016, had this specific small pot of money, a few $100,000. So work to work in some of the parishes most intensely impacted by climate change and by sea level rise more explicitly. You know, okay, well, let's try it. And we also are bringing money to the table. So maybe this is an opportunity. And I do think this is something that arose. There are some things that foundation for Louisiana or another philanthropic institution can invest in, that are much harder for government funds to be moved to, it's much easier for our staff to move stipends to support community leaders in facilitating conversations than it is for a multibillion dollar state agency to move, you know, $100 a meeting to support transportation and compensation for time. Right.

Peter Ravella  18:16  
Yeah. So let's, let's talk about the you mentioned that the conversations are difficult the the notion that the coastal master plan anticipates the loss of not only land in spite of the tremendous efforts that the state has made making, but a loss of communities as well. And those difficult conversations, as you say, are part of the work that you're doing the gap that you're filling, is to institute this inclusive planning process that engages these communities in, you know, as you say, a very difficult conversation to confront the reality of the loss of culture and community that's happening on the Louisiana shoreline. What's it been like for you to jump in the middle of that conversation? That difficult conversation?

Liz Russell  19:08  
Yeah, I want to acknowledge that we are one of the many players that are working to have these conversations, and just really elevate the work of community leaders and community based organizations who are necessarily having these conversations. And where we can provide support in all kinds of ways, both in terms of grants or materials, access to decision makers, technical information and data that might be talking points for some of our community partners. It is really the leaders who are embedded in the individual communities who are holding these conversations. So I just want to fully acknowledge that that all of this work would be possible wouldn't be possible without those, those partners but we have I think that that said We have helped to push conversations that maybe weren't being had before, before the LA safe process, which I know we'll get to, you know, my colleagues at the state and I were told we were going to have our tire slashed and tomatoes thrown at us, we couldn't possibly go into XYZ communities down the river, the bayou, and talk about the reality that is illustrated in the coastal master plan maps. Okay. And that was not true at all. You have we, we had these conversations. And, you know, we opened up this dialog, we said, This is what we see from the maps, you know, 50 years back 50 years forward, these are the trends we see. These are the population movements, we see accordingly, the data of where people are moving to and from, you know, how have you experience that, and some of the comments we got was like, we're like, thank you for finally coming down and saying this, because we all know what's happening. And dancing around it is not, it doesn't benefit anyone. That's a thank you for finally being explicit about it. And also, like, let's talk about what's really happening and all the scales that that's happening, and all the ripple effects that that has, for real estate values, job access, health care, access, the ability to get my kids to school, on and on and on.

Peter Ravella  21:22  
Hmm. So what what is the that's, you know, so you're you end up in these planning processes at the local level with local leaders and stakeholders and residents, to inform them of the risks coming, as you said, the long term trends and changes in shoreline position and loss of land, and what it means for the community? And is this a listening tour? Is this what you're going town to town and trying to give people a chance to react to this reality? What's what do you actually do? And when you go into these communities?

Unknown Speaker  21:59  
Yeah, so I would say that's not how it started. In 2016, we held a couple of big meetings with did a lot of research ahead of time for who were how do we have a representative swath of community leaders from neighborhood organizations, faith based groups, fisheries associations, different leaders in the community who who who may not hold any formal position, but who are the neighbor that people look to because they happen to stay more informed in all these ways. And we brought them together and asked what that process would look like, by the end of 2016, sort of serendipitously and the state of Louisiana had received in $92.6 million as part of the National Disaster Recovery competition, both to support the resettlement of El Chapo and the the LA safe program Louisiana strategic adaptations for future environments, which was at the time, frankly, a 13 page policy paper. And, and I had been having many conversations with all sorts of decision makers in the sort of planning, community planning and development spaces. from the Office of Community Development, the winner of that NDRC award, to the local planning offices, cpra staff, the different stuff from FEMA, to excuse me, just say, Hey, guys, this is what we're doing down in Plaquemines Parish. What do y'all have any torpedoes we need to watch out for? Are speed bumps and like what do you think and just kind of keeping them aware? And then as this money came in for the NDRC competition, and the idea sort of emerged between ffl and OCD staff, what if we could work together to co fund that and co co manage the implementation of this planning process that we had supported in designing in Plaquemines Parish, but in the six parishes that were eligible for those dollars following Hurricane Isaac six parishes with remaining unmet needs and actually six parishes that over time. This data is actually a couple of years old now have received eight and a half percent of the national NFIB payouts. So it's a not an unrepresentative group of parishes for Louisiana. And sort of the work emerged. And then all of a sudden, something we had designed and we're planning to implement in one parish meant we're now doing it in six parishes and across 2017. We had more than 70 community meetings that community engagement events, some are parish wide, some are small community meetings. We asked residents to designate where we should be having meetings instead of decision makers from outside of communities citing that so they're going okay, you can have one here and here but don't have one here. People don't cross the river to get to this one. So then you'll have to and that are basically the same group of people. So you need to have one here to compensate for that or You know, if you have one here, you really need to have this restaurant be the caterers because like more people are going to show up if you have this, this bread pudding especially right. So the level of dialogue and just, frankly, like, co co design co collaborated, thinking was at every level of this process. And then it was definitely listening sessions, but also like design sessions. We were drawing on maps on tables. And, and and having very real conversations.

Tyler Buckingham  25:37  
Sounds, it sounds like there was a creative vibe, which is cool. I think there's some sort of optimism. It seems that was achieved. Let me ask, first of all, I, I've got a just I'm so interested in this process. But could you take us through? Like, how many Could you take us into the room? Like what? Okay, so we're at the place, you got the right bread pudding, we've got we're on the right side of the river. And what we describe to me like what, what kind of building are we in? How many people are in there?

Peter Ravella  26:15  
What are you talking about? Yeah, yeah. Signing when you say what are you designing? So you get the maps out? What are you trying to decide what to do? Sure.

Liz Russell  26:25  
Okay, so the meetings are generally held at local auditoriums or local gyms, or, in some cases, local libraries, or, in some cases, like a faith based organization would host. And we tried to work with the partners in that Parish, to designate that. I also want to be very clear that this process was not just the foundation for Louisiana and the Office of Community Development. We had a slew of community, nonprofit, public, private and philanthropic allies. So the state to your earlier question of what what what government can invest in versus what ffl can, you know, the state could ensure that the contractors, design contractors were staffed to be able to sort of create drawings that came from the community, sort of modeling that community design drawings that occurred on the table and come back? And the next round of meeting say, Is this what you said, right, um, we were able to provide grants to a slew of nonprofits across the six parish area. And for organizations that wanted to both recruit people there wanted to go door to door and talk about like what people wanted to see for people who are never going to turn up at the meetings, and on and on. And then I also want to touch on the lead the coast program, which was a key investment is an investment of the foundation for the Louisiana. And there's a for Saturday leadership education advocacy development program, where we go into coastal climate 101, race, power and privilege, facilitation training, organizing, training, advocacy training, and we had more than 65 graduates of that program, we ran it three times before we launched la safe 65 graduates went on to be the facilitators of these 70 public meetings, in collaboration with FSL staff, OCD staff, and and some of the state contractors, some of our grantees on and on. And so in these meetings, you know, there was always a sort of bounce between presentation at the front, to break out into your tables of like six to 10 people, and then talk at your tables about like, what was just said, How have you experienced that? And then those conversations also evolved over the five rounds of meetings. Even by the by the first end of the first meeting, we're already turning into How could your community be better? Right? How could your community be more resilient, more healthy, more vibrant, in the face of all these challenges? And so from from the first round of meetings in March of 2017, people were already brainstorming, and people were already thinking, you know, okay, well, you know, it is it's really traumatic, so faceless level of risk, and and what does it mean to have a place where I feel safe and secure. And so some of those conversations, you know, turned into conversations about communities where things might be different in some places turned into what could be done in the place where I currently live. To mitigate these risks. I will say we really backed into the conversations around communities no longer existing. We said 10 years from now, 25 years from now. 50 years from now we use As a generational framework, so we said 10 years from now, maybe you're thinking about yourself, right? Maybe you're thinking about your kids 25 years from now, maybe you're thinking about yourself, but more likely you're thinking about your kids or grandkids, and 50 years from now, most people in the room are not thinking about themselves, they're thinking about the generations to come. And that was the the framework through which we backed into, where we see communities disappearing. And so then all of a sudden, we had people more willing to talk about that future. You know, I may never move, right, this kind of language, I'm never gonna move, but my kids have already moved, they move to the next town up because it's higher and safer. Or I want them to have this better life. And so I hope that they move to, you know, North home or tibideaux, where it's higher land outside of this low line, but by region. But also we have a situation in Adana that other people around the country don't have, right, we have had so many storms, and so much land loss already, that there's a historic trend that makes the future easier to wrap your head around. And so that is a unique set of things for Louisiana. And it also gives us the tools to engage with people's personal experience, as opposed to projecting out a set of conditions that they may not be as familiar with.

Tyler Buckingham  31:23  
Yeah, I often think about how, obviously, Louisiana is a particularly dynamic state, being the delta and everything, but I think about coastal communities like this. Dynamic coasts are dynamic, they change a lot. So when you're thinking about how to talk about change, you can use the history of the place. I am how talk, let's talk a little bit about the scale of thinking in these, these meetings. So you're dealing with a local community, you've targeted a specific community, a specific Parish, and specific leaders to come to the table. How big is the thinking? You know, I think that part of the problem when we think about resilience, you know, it's kind of that is a term that we throw around. And it can mean like nothing. And also, and everything. And climate change can be like the same thing like you we can talk about, you know, well, China's admitted and, and there's just nothing we can do about it, I'm just going to go about living my life. You can think about these things in like big planetary frameworks, or you can think about them extremely locally, like, Hey, we got to pick up our trash and get the plastic out of our I'm just curious to know how, over the course of these meetings, what sense of scale communities in Louisiana that are confronting an existential question, what is there a blame thing going on? Like how, what's what's, how is this issue being framed up? And on what scale? Is it being framed up?

Liz Russell  33:07  
So, you know, from a climate change perspective, we we were at the time, you know, we were not using climate change as the vocabulary, we use sea level rise, we use the impacts of climate change locally, this was mostly an adaptation planning process. There were when we talk when we got into the sector specific ideas like transportation or housing, or job access, then you emerge, then you sort of emerged into, you know, greener paths, if you will, and paths to reduce emissions through sector diversification and job creation in the coastal restoration or water management space, or wind farm manufacturing, or, you know, the different paths to reduce emissions in transportation or housing is an individual sector. But we did not have those just full, you know, with full transparency, we did not have emissions, or climate change calls and conversations in, in the larger conversation in the in the big room, if you will,

Tyler Buckingham  34:10  
right, wasn't on the agenda formally.

Unknown Speaker  34:14  
Yeah, and I think that avoided some of the politicization that that tends to occur from from a question of scale. We fluctuated between sort of the municipal or community scale to the parish scale to the region scale, and then back and forth. And, and, and I will say, you know, the community leaders were who we targeted to help get people out. But these were very much public meetings. We blasted on Facebook, on all sorts of social media, we had road signs everywhere. We put it in the radio and local newspapers. These were very much meant to be come one come all. And also we did pay special attention to the communities that are historically left out of these conversations, and made sure that nonprofits from black communities, indigenous communities, LGBTQ communities, communities of color, low income communities had designated sort of organizations that were actively seeking out residents in their neighborhood to make sure that they knew that they were welcome. And that their opinion was wanted, and that they weren't a key designer in that future. But the question of scale was really critical. And it allowed people to sort of dream locally and on the maps drawing, you know, we have this sort of regional crowdsource land use map that came from this, and what was really apparent to us at the end, because we were also told by other allies that like, people aren't going to make good decisions about where things should go. And that's wrong. People make really informed decisions, when they're given the time, energy space and data in front of them to, again, connect their personal experience, our experience was that people made very informed decisions. And of course, you always have that like kind of crazy, wonky idea, like somebody at the very end of the Mississippi River area, that's subsiding, an inch and a half a year in Venice, wanted a big box target with a Starbucks in it. And it's like, of course, like I can't get into the extent to which global market forces decide whether, you know, that is going to happen in that area, both from a population standpoint, market standpoint, environmental sustainability standpoint, but the crux of of need was in there, that person had to drive an hour and a half to get to fresh produce from a local store without going to somebody they knew his yard. And they had to drive an hour to get a cup of coffee. And so the lack of having access to amenities was something that needed to be thought about and thought about across those low, moderate and high flood risk areas. Because even as our communities change, and and even as they disappear, the vibrant fisheries and realities of Louisiana's working post will mean that some semblance of places is still there, until it's completely gone. And so what does that? What does it look like to acknowledge that and plan for that, and not only be coming from a place of retreat and surrender, but a place of imagining envisioning what the future might look like?

Peter Ravella  37:18  
Well? Well, you know, as we said, climate change ultimately is a people problem. This is where sort of the rubber meets the road or the tie tides, we reach the road. But you're doing this crowd sourced land use planning these inclusive engaged community planning sessions, right and over 70, it sounds like 70 meetings in the program that you're directing? What is the impact of all of that good work? And the voices that you're hearing? Does it influence state spending or philanthropic spending? How does it manifest in the real world?

Liz Russell  38:01  
So they're across the board answers to that question. And, you know, one of the commitments the state of Louisiana made at the start of this process was to each of the parishes, each of the six parishes, we had meetings with all their elected officials. Look, if you play ball, the state of Louisiana is going to make an investment in your community. We don't already know what that investment is, it's going to come from this process. You know, we knew behind the scenes that it would be about a five to $7 million investment from the $40 million that was available through the program. And by the last round of public meetings, well, actually, you know, by the later rounds, we had six pilot potential projects for each of the parishes that had emerged, from all of that crowdsource land use planning, all of the ideas that people had put on the table, and all of the frankly, the ongoing work that was already occurring in parishes, that was not just a project that's been talked about for 40 years, and then it's just sitting on a shelf somewhere. But something that's still really relevant and really needed. And we pulled six of those and design six of those sort of hypothetical Community Development investments. And then in the final round of meetings, we asked the residents to vote on which project they wanted to see invested in their parish. And we did this in a really transparent way. We had these awesome clear tubes, one of our design teams was really fantastic at creating these clear tubes. Everybody got tokens, when they got into the meeting, they had six tokens, they got to vote with their tokens or where they wanted to go to, were yellow to or green to were blue, the yellow were the top the blue was the bottom ranked choice. And at the end, we unwrapped these clear tubes because they were hidden the whole meeting. And so everyone who was at the meeting, got to see what had received the most most votes, right, because the the clear tube that's more yellow shows that that's the winner as opposed to a clear tube that's more blue or green. It's like yeah, we like that. But also It's not our favorite. We also had an online voting system that we threw together, where people for three weeks from the parishes got to come vote on which project they wanted, whether they had been to the meeting or not, there were things on the website they could look at, and decide which projects to invest in. So, so, yeah, so

Peter Ravella  40:18  
it's really cool.

Liz Russell  40:19  
40 I mean, I don't think this has happened in the state of Louisiana. And I suspect not many other states either, right. But to see the state actually commit to the top projects that were voted on by the public. Yeah. So there's $41 million of investments and 10 projects that were were, well, that top or top two projects in every area. And then there's a few others that the state really wanted to support moving forward.

Peter Ravella  40:42  
Let me ask you a question. So you said five to $7 million was made available is that per Parish, parish? Okay, so total of around $40 million is on the table. Um, see if I can follow along what you do. And it sounds like a really great process. You have a series of events in these communities, as I think No, this is not a one shot deal. You're there no one, developing relationships with the community inviting them in with a stack of money already on the table. This is what's great about this is they're not going to apply for a grant the states that, look, we've got five to $7 million for your town, what do you want us to do in relation to the problems you're discussing? And it really empowers the community? How was the reaction? I mean, I'm very interested what I mean, obviously, we don't need to go through every parish and project that was selected, but but I've got to think that

Tyler Buckingham  41:35  
I got to hear about one. Yeah,

Peter Ravella  41:36  
I mean, we got to hear about one and when the tube is unveiled, and you see what the winning project is, is are people clapping, or they're like fireworks.

Tyler Buckingham  41:44  
Yeah, see confetti?

Peter Ravella  41:46  
When does it start I mean, when does the check come?

Liz Russell  41:49  
I have a smile on my face just thinking about this round of meetings in December 2017. Because it was honestly fun. We had also for this round, like gotten some local musicians. So like, there's Cajun music at some of them zydeco and it was fun. Yeah. eah. You know, sure. Lots of I mean, I swear we have bread pudding at every meeting so much bread pudding a year. But, but no, we, I think the five to $7 million. I want to come back to that, because it's really important. But But you know, there was there was like a Yeah, you know, there's cheering for some people. There's, there's like, ah, but also like, okay, that's all right, I see all these people I know, you know, and they voted for something I didn't vote for, but like, we're all here. And we're doing this and like, they're all good projects. Like none of them were like, bad projects. Um, I would also say, you know, we were a little apprehensive of like, what if some, you know, random person or elected official or a developer or somebody gets everyone to turn out for their project. And in one Parish, that kind of happened? There was there was actually two different projects, I guess it like, word got out. You got to get to this meeting, and everybody's gonna vote. And there's these two projects, like top projects,

Peter Ravella  43:09  
So there was a little lobbying going on right campaigning going on. You know, this is America, we expect that.

Liz Russell  43:15  
Yeah. And it wasn't A bad thing, because it's like, Okay, well, at least it got everybody the meetings and they all walked around and looked at the boards and, you know, talked with people about the flood risk and the land change and all the things that are happening in their parish, and maybe they wouldn't have participated before.

Peter Ravella  43:32  
Okay, so cool projects on that. What are the top coolest projects that you think chemo process? Of

Liz Russell  43:37  
course, there are some that are like green infrastructure, stormwater management, reducing flood risk, generally, we have a emerging industry incubator to so to specifically support coastal restoration and water management entrepreneur access in the value region. We had a safe harbor for fishermen, we had affordable, resilient housing, so housing in a moderate risk area, but like, what does it look like to be low emissions sustainable, and also resilient to flooding? That's cool. Yeah,

Peter Ravella  44:11  
elevated flood proof, that kind of thing, new affordable housing in less risky areas. Right. That's substantial. that's meaningful.

Liz Russell  44:22  
And I think that the five to $7 million. I just want to highlight this because it's such an important amount of money.

Tyler Buckingham  44:28  
Is this the per parish money? Yeah, yeah. Just to make sure I'm following

Peter Ravella  44:32  
the money around 40 million total 40.

Unknown Speaker  44:38  
And if Max, you know, the state could spend 15% on planning. You know, what was the total that was available, so so we just kind of broke it down there. Honestly, the state of Louisiana ended up adding additional money to the pot and ended up investing $41 million in projects in addition to the planning, which was super exciting, but the five to seven million dollars was enough money to get people to play to get elected officials interested. Without the political arm twisting that comes with a bigger chunk of money.

Peter Ravella  45:15  
I'm digging this process. Now I'm starting to understand this is a pretty, I love the upfront commitment. And then, of course, that would incentivize people to participate and be part of it and help define the list of projects that are going to be voted on. Okay. I mean, they're, they're involved in that stage. They're not just given a list.

Tyler Buckingham  45:32  
I just want to play hypothetical develop that I want to play hypothetical governance systems perspective. So like, just so I can a understand this list. But also, I think that I think that there's an important thing, because you were talking about, like, freeing up these local politicians, who are a part who have Tat, you know, there are taxes, there are budgets that need to be, and by the state putting the money on the table. Yeah. It frees up the local politicians to just simply support whichever project, the community the community kind of goes with is that is that fair to say? Were these did it?

Peter Ravella  46:17  
Did it depoliticize the conversation a little bit? I mean, is that which

Liz Russell  46:21  
I think a little bit yeah. And I would say, you know, there were so much documentation of all of the ideas that had gone into forming these projects. No elected official is like a battering ram,

Tyler Buckingham  46:35  
you can't get in the way. You're just gonna bowl you over? I don't know. Yeah,

Liz Russell  46:39  
no elected official is gonna stand up and say, like, my constituents don't want this. They tried at the beginning to say that some of them not all of them. But like, we don't need this here. You know, that kind of thing. That's why the five to 7 million was what's important. But, but like, know that constituents actually do want this, actually, that the incubator was an important one for that, because local officials would have told us that constituents had no interest in diversification of the economy beyond the existing predominantly oil and gas related workforce opportunities. Yeah. And what we heard across our coastal parishes who have all been the state of Louisiana has historically been very tied to that industry. If you look at the data, it is it has never recovered from the 1980s oil slump, in terms of job access, and actually revenue creation continues to decline. But we have a narrative that supports that industry in particular, but that we got there we got to that incubator, because their constituents that said there are billions of dollars being spent in our communities for coastal restoration. And why are we not getting access to those jobs and business opportunity? Right,

Peter Ravella  47:49  
let's talk about that. I love this. I love this. So part of the part of the conversations that occurred at the local level, down on the coast of Louisiana was this notion of in the bayou, why aren't we part of the investment in climate adaptation? Why aren't we creating local companies to elevate houses and flood proof and do stormwater management and do restoration work? Why are those companies being created right here in our communities? That sounds like a fantastic outcome of the process. And were actual investments made in this this incubator, I guess, is a business development, investment in climate adaptation. Jobs, right?

Liz Russell  48:33  
Yeah, it is it is. And it's also just a one drop in the bucket. But this is, I think, a key that's relevant across the nation, we tend to keep so divided the conversations on emissions reduction, and adaptation. And the reality in my opinion in Louisiana, is that you cannot get to one without the other. The tremendous investment that is required to go ahead and start investing in adaptation and reduced risk to climate induced disasters is what gets us to the inclusive economy. If we set it up, right, that allows us to wean our reliance or perceived reliance on extractive industries. And we're just not taking advantage of that. So you know, for me, I want to see matching investments from Louisiana economic development, the Workforce Commission, the Federal Small Business Administration. And as we continue to invest in adaptation across Louisiana and across the country, I want to see us building and incorporating racial and gender equity into the infrastructure that we design, to build out these new economies. And be sure that we're reducing the increased economic disparities that we see across all of our communities, through the investments to build a more healthy, vibrant, just and resilient world. If that word can mean, can mean specifically at this point reduced. An ability to rebound.

Tyler Buckingham  50:07  
I like that. I like the way that feels going into my brain. Now I have to ask, I want, we will talk more about the future and what the future holds. And but one thing I just have to ask you about is when I think of Louisianans, I think of, I think of self reliance, you know, I think of like a long cultural history of kind of doing it their own way on their own. And I'm just wondering how it First of all, I mean, this is this is a stereotype that I'm throwing out there, but was that a, does that exist? And was that harnessed at all in the community discussion about resilience and kind of sustainable scenario planning into the future where it's like, Hey, we we need to be able to exist autonomously as a community like we have each other's backs? I mean, I'm just curious, you know, how that folds in? Or if it does at all?

Liz Russell  51:20  
I think it did. And I think it does, I think it did into the process, because that's how we got all of these great ideas to emerge in the types of investments that the state would make. I think, absolutely. The Louisiana ingenuity is there, I think it will continue to emerge as we support these emerging economic opportunities across the state, and recognize that diversification is a key to our future, we know that communities with fewer resources are less able to adapt. So what does it mean to actually accommodate that at every level of our government infrastructure? I think when it comes to, you know, the future and the present, I see emerging ideas, and innovations all over the place, I see the point of Cheyenne Indian tribe, who has built elevated gardens so that they can continue to grow their produce. But when they get a southwind, and some of their community is flooding, they don't lose their entire crop of a community garden. I see people tying p rows to their houses, so they know they can get I'm sorry, that's a small wooden boat in Louisiana.

Yeah, but but I see people doing things, and they're not, you know, we shouldn't all have to do these things. And also, of course, innovation comes, you know, I found myself kayaking down my street, a year and a half ago in New Orleans, because we had eight inches of rain and an hour and a half. So, you know, it's, it's, this isn't, we have to be able to imagine ourselves into the future, and it has to be able to be the thing we want to live in. Otherwise, we're never gonna wrap our heads around that.

Peter Ravella  53:19  
That's pretty good. Liz. And so let me just ask, let's talk about the money part of it. I love the process, I understand how what you're doing here seems quite innovative and interesting. And something other states might want to consider $40,000,000.05 to $7 million per parish data, the coastal protection and restoration authority, the state agency that that handles the projects list is about I don't know, we're well north of $50 billion, and a lot of money in there a lot of money in that. Building barrier islands, you know, the diversion channels, the all of the work that is being done on the big dollars now $40 million? I like. I think it needs to be higher funded, number one, number two, is it a one shot deal? Are we going to do this again? Is this just we did it one time? And that's great. And we're done? Or are you looking for round two, with these projects, either in the same parishes or in other areas of Louisiana? Close? What's the scoop?

Liz Russell  54:24  
You know, I'm glad you asked that, you know, the cpra $50 billion is is sort of legally required to be spent in the current manner, which is designated

Peter Ravella  54:35  
for it.

Liz Russell  54:36  
So that that's there, right? Yeah. And, you know, the every single parish in the state of Louisiana has been under at least one if not many federally, declared flood disasters in the last 15 years. Yeah. And so right now there is a statewide effort called the Louisiana watershed initiative to plans statewide for watershed planning, and planning statewide for watershed management, I'm sorry. And I would say it's not, it's not where Alec safe is, there are certain elements of lie safe that are being being attempted to be incorporated. But, you know, we don't have statewide the level of sophistication in terms of flood flood maps that we have for the coastal area from the master plan. And so I see that as a first at the very least, a first step in more comprehensively understanding our flood risk across the state, and making investments to have more comprehensive water management across an area that drains 41% of the country, right. But the bigger thing for me is that every state agency needs to be aligning with both both climate emissions reduction, as well as climate adaptation, and incorporating the existing asset vulnerabilities, existing practices and programs, as well as future planning, future development, future investment into this horizon. It shouldn't be one agency's job, it has to be all of our jobs. And that's how you're going to leverage the amount of money that's required, because it won't just be coastal money or climate money. It'll be any dollars going towards public health accommodate for the mental health care strains, that we're seeing an area's losing population and with extreme storm events, okay. Or it'll be, you know, economic development that includes diversification and leveraging the billions of dollars that are already being spent and are more secure than any established revenue stream we've ever had.

Peter Ravella  56:46  
Very good. Yeah, it is. And so this is my kind of question is, is john Bel Edwards, the great governor of Louisiana. What you're arguing for here is that this process is actually conducive to a wide variety of state and federal investment dollars that are being brought into coastal communities, works communities, statewide. So what I want to know is what did john Bell, john Bel Edwards and the rest of the leadership in the state think about the process you executed? are they thinking, boy, this is a model that really connects us to local needs. And in a, in a really good way, make sure that our spending decisions are responsive to local needs? How did it play? what's the what's the word on the street?

Liz Russell  57:33  
Yeah, I think I think the Edwards administration certainly acknowledges and respects the process and and the way it worked and the ideas that have come from it. And we see that in his leadership to both establish sign an executive order requiring coastal resilience and climate resilience, sort of investments across state agencies, at least staffing beginning to pay attention there. I wouldn't say that it's directly building on the takeaways from the community design that occurred in the Le safe process, but it is a first step in in beginning to understand across the agencies where and how to improve resilience outcomes. JOHN bell has also signed an executive order establishing the climate Task Force and our senior leadership and myself and many of our allies are, are on that are a part of it, that this climate task forces actually to designate actionable pathways to reduce emissions to get to net zero in the state of Louisiana by 2050. And, and that's a huge step for Louisiana. And so ensuring that there are are worthwhile tactics that are that are actually taking significant mentionable and actionable steps towards achieving that goal is tremendous. And so I'm really grateful for for his leadership here. I think there's still a lot left to do. At the foundation for Louisiana, you know, we are doubling down on investments that have emerged from this work. And so, you know, across the board, we're always making investments to build people power by strengthening civic engagement, infrastructure and capacity to advance just climate policies, creating equitable outcomes through analysis, research recommendations, and advocating where it makes sense, and then cultivating narratives to actually catalyze statewide climate action. But more specifically, we also understand that we can lead our work in a in a direction that lends the greatest potential for change. And for us, that is economic opportunity, environmental justice and equitable development as part of a climate justice portfolio. So what does it mean to ensure that we're building inclusive economic opportunities through both the coastal restoration and water management investments, but also through other emerging sectors could help to diversify the economy while reducing the economic disparities that are built into our state. What does it mean to acknowledge that the petrochemical corridor in the state of Louisiana has continued to harm our communities? And what does it mean to acknowledge that harm? Even while we acknowledge our reliance on that industry? What does it mean to ensure that the communities most impacted by those decisions, you know, 80% of those facilities are put next to black communities 100% next to low income communities are a part of the designs to actually reduce greenhouse gases and emissions, remediate toxicities, and preserve Louisiana's natural resources for future generations. A lot of the areas where we're seeing expanded petrochemical investment are the high ground areas where we actually need to be poised to grow in an inclusive way to accommodate migration. And finally, speaking of growth in the equitable development space, we continue to invest in analysis of where we're seeing ongoing population movement, who is able to move what are the factors that influence migration, and that has a lot of ramifications to housing and development. So how do we ensure affordable and inclusive communities across the state, both in areas losing population with the tremendous effects there, as well as the areas growing in population continuing to expand development, seeing predatory land acquisition, climate, gentrification and development without any regard for where water is going or could go, both with extreme rainfall and increased sea level rise. And so the work continues. And I would say these these projects all build on takeaways from the LA safe process, this portfolio has has always been built out of the hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of community meetings that we've had. And so I'm really excited to see more expanded and Targeted Investment across sectors in Louisiana, to really get to a more healthy, just and vibrant state.

Tyler Buckingham  1:02:09  
Well, I have to say, just my gut reaction here, as a as my final thought on on this show, Peter, is that it seems like Liz, you figured out how to do the bottom up thing, you managed to get the flow, the the idea flow, the energy flow, to come from the bottom up, and I realized that was a huge team effort. It wasn't it wasn't just you, or the the leadership that did it, it was it was the bottom up in energy came from the grassroots and worked its way up into a place where projects could be funded. And that just really, that's the ticket to me of like a good democratic process, a good way to solve problems, a good way to get buy in and support. And so often when we run into problems, I feel like it's because we're jumping a step where we're skipping over that process, you know, either because, because of some sort of dirty corruption or because of, you know, just we forget it.

Peter Ravella  1:03:18  
It's it's negligence, lack of appreciation for why it matters. Right. Totally.

Tyler Buckingham  1:03:25  
as a final question, for me, I am wondering if you have any, you know, these processes, these community processes are happening happening all over the American shoreline in all sectors? Do you have any advice for people who are leading these efforts and trying to get that that energy flow from the bottom to the top? And what what would you advise people to do?

Liz Russell  1:03:53  
I would advise people to send their local leadership, first of all, and center, the the many different types of leaders that we have in our communities across the country, to recognize that the speed of trust is slow. And there are decades and generations of experience of maybe government not following through on promises they've made or going another direction, or just the transitions and electoral cycles influencing where investments fall through the cracks, that mean that you know, that the, the distrust is perpetual, and the only way to break through that is through genuine relationships and accountability. And, and through actually genuinely collaborating with the people from communities and acknowledging their time. You know, as I mentioned, we we had 65 lead the coast graduates the facilitators of the public meetings. We we provided, you know, stipends of $15 an hour. But we have also continued to expand that practice and have now tiers of stipends for all the ways that we engage community members. But really centering those folks, the last thing I would mention is that institutionalized and systemic racism are built into every level of our policies and practices. They especially show up in the way that racialized real estate valuation is incorporated into cost benefit analyses that prioritize investments. And so understanding the ways in which racism has been built into our decision making fabrics and infrastructures is really critical to us, working to reduce disparities, as we as we adapt to climate change. And as we take steps to mitigate climate change, as opposed to exacerbating the existing inequities that are built into our social fabric and, frankly, continue to exacerbate the distrust I mentioned before.

Peter Ravella  1:06:05  
Wow. Well, it is clear that there's something cool going on down in Louisiana by you when it comes to climate change adaptation. And folks, I think paying attention to the work of the foundation for Louisiana and Liz William Russell's efforts, is something I'd advise people around the country to take a hard look at, they have that you guys are at the spear point of these issues, I think it's incredibly innovative. I think the lessons that you're learning and applying are incredibly important and are going to come up in Virginia, and in Florida, and in North Carolina, and all the coastal states around around America. This is how you got to do it. And it's down and dirty. And it's with the people. And it's hard work. And it's you got to listen,

Tyler Buckingham  1:06:52  
I have one more thing to add. I know I said, I have my final thought. But I got I got one more final thought. So all you we got iPhones, right? So I feel like Liz, there's some some some folks out there might be a little turned off by this idea of climate justice in your title. Oh, it's that soft, that's social, that's not you know, listen, when you get an iPhone, and every so often there's a software update that comes down to that iPhone, or your cell phone. The the the notion is, it's getting better things change, you'll notice that the thing that works a little differently, that's the the flow of the operating system changes a little bit. And what I'm saying is, this is an evolution in process. To me, that's in the social process. And for those of us who, particularly people who have done this for a long time have been engaged in coastal, you know, beach projects, X, Y, or Z, this might sound a little, I don't know, out there, but I guarantee that these, this is the way of the future. And the sooner you can like get that software update and become comfortable with it. And just, I think it is better. So that's just my, I'm just pushing, you know, don't, don't write off this notion This is going to be I've very firmly believe that this is going to be you know, apple pie.

Peter Ravella  1:08:29  
The future, the agreement, climate justice, and the recognition that systemic racism and practices, past practices influence how these problems are going to be looked at how the investments are going to be made, who is going to benefit? Those are, those decisions are all influenced by the historic context at the country. And so I think I'm with the climate justice being a, a predominant part of the thinking here in terms of actual engagement at the local level, listening, working, understanding the disparities in the past that contribute to decision making, that is unjust, is sensible, and I think you're right, it's gonna that's not gonna, that's not gonna quit happening, that's going to need to happen.

Tyler Buckingham  1:09:19  
It's going to be essential. It's go it's a part of the process now. So I just, I just want to say let's, let's embrace it.

Peter Ravella  1:09:28  
Yeah. So Liz, final thoughts from you? And also how do people keep up and learn about what you're doing, please?

Liz Russell  1:09:36  
Yeah, and so just to learn more about what the foundation for Louisiana is up to, and then you can always check out foundation for louisiana.org. If you'd like to contribute to the work of the foundation foundation for louisiana.org slash donate. We've actually just launched a 15 for 15 campaign, it is our 15th anniversary and as we double down and continue To expand this work, we're excited to continue seeking investment for an endowment that ensures sustainability of work towards equity and justice for the state of Louisiana. You know, generally, I will add also, if you'd like to learn more about the LA safe process, la safe that la.gov also includes the seven adaptation strategies, planning documents that emerged from this planning process, as well as more information about the 10 investments that were made from that $41 million. I'm realizing we didn't even talk about the adaptation strategies. But there are lots of policy recommendations, and design thinking, visioning built into these these planning documents for each parish and then for the region as a whole. I am grateful and really energized for the amount of work that I see taking place. And I just want to acknowledge the way that I am also seeing people try to grapple with the really hard stuff. It isn't easy. And and and it's not easy when you're talking about climate change and emissions reduction and adaptation and future community viability. And it certainly is not easy when you're talking about institutionalized and systemic racism, especially as a white woman like myself. But that work is, is necessary. And it's important that we don't see ourselves as apart from these communities. This work is personal. It is everything that we care about, is the future of the places we live and the world. We appreciate. And, and it's generational work. And so we have to be investing both in ourselves and in the people around us for the decades and generations to come. Because this is this is long and necessary and enduring work and I believe in our capacity to do it.

Peter Ravella  1:12:01  
really outstanding phrase of the interview, I thought the speed of trust is slow. I love that. Me too. I think that the work that you've done and how you're doing it is is really the guideline that guiding light for a lot of planners and folks out there trying to figure out how to respond to changing conditions along the American shoreline. Ladies and gentlemen, it is Liz Williams Russel. She is the climate justice program director at the foundation for Louisiana, and part of the community of people who are working hard to figure out how to respond most effectively and most fairly to sea level rise and climate change on the American shoreline. Liz, thanks for taking the time to be with us.

Liz Russell  1:12:48  
Thanks so much for having me.

‍